One of the things I really enjoy about
this blog is the opportunities I get to talk to some of the superstars of fly
fishing. I’ve interviewed
photographer extraordinaire Brian O’Keefe and the mastermind behind The Drake Tom Bie. My latest interview is no
exception.
Marshall Cutchin started out as a
reluctant fishing guide in Key West who eventually became one of the key’s
pioneers. Seeking a change
of pace, Marshall moved out west to Montana and then eventually to Colorado
where he started Midcurrent.com, the biggest fly fishing Web site on the
internet. Today, he’s started a
new project, Skiff Republic.
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| Marshall Cutchin |
Below is my conversation with Marshall:
With Midcurrent, you've created the grand-daddy of fly
fishing Web sites. You've got a new web site that I think is just brilliant and
that is Skiff Republic. Can you tell me how Skiff Republic came to be and
what's your vision for it?
Midcurrent is a gigantic beast that
requires constant feeding and tending that requires 7 days a week and a 12 hour
a day job. I was toying with the
idea of taking with what I’ve learned with Midcurrent and turning into
something fun and Skiff Republic seemed a logical thing today because even
after 15 years of being out of guiding I still at least once a week dream of
driving my skiff around. I love
small boats and what they can do.
It takes years to understand. Learning how to take a boat to a place in all kinds of
weather and position and pole the boat by itself is a fascinating thing. Skiff Republic is a new thing that I
wanted to do for fun and see where it would go. There still isn’t a place where newbies can go and learn
about skiffs and what you should be looking for. With boat design, you have continuity of what people have tried
to do and materials have changed.
Have we hit a wall in skiff development? Do you think they
can get much skinnier, quieter, and better than what is out there now?
It’s in some ways parallel with what’s
happening with fishing gear and rod and reel development. There are a lot of people who have favorite
boats and rods from 20 or 30 years ago who think they are better than what is
coming out today. In my own
experience, I’ve had four different brands of skiffs. My first was my favorite. A lot of time skiff manufacturers will do something that
doesn’t improve performance. There’s
no question that what happened with resins and fusion and vacuum bagging was a
game changer in skiff design. If
only because it allowed manufacturers to come out with consistent designs, not
everything was hand laid. New
materials could be introduced.
Whether the hulls or not they get skinnier depends on engine design. The
shift from two-stroke to four-stroke added weight to the boats. There are people thinking beyond what
is out there and customizing their own skiffs.
You have the Cadillac’s out there like Hells Bay and
Maverick, I'll lump in Dolphin. What about these companies like Ankona and
Skull Island who are building more price point skiffs that are getting good reviews?
How do you foresee these boats changing the game, if at all?
I think it’s healthy for the market to
have people passionate about building skiffs for the masses. There is no
question you can build skiffs for less money just because of the evolution of technology and design. The knowledge is not that hard to get
anymore. The guys building the
boats in the 60’s, 70’s, and 80’s were inventing as they go along. Now you’ve got a culture that is pretty
well educated. The longer term
question is can these new designs survive from a business prospective. Initial runs are advertised as affordable
but as demand goes up price goes up.
There aren’t a lot of skiffs sold each year. Companies are trying to stay cash flow positive. No one can blame them for staying cash
flow positive. If you had to build
a boat like this yourself, you’d spend a heck of a lot more money trying to
build one.
There’s room on both sides of the scale
for up-and-comers and for companies like Maverick who have seen it all.
Many people know you as the founder of Midcurrent, but
actually you were one of the early fly fishing guides in the Florida Keys. How
has the guide business changed over the years?
The biggest change happened while I was
still guiding, at least if you’re talking about guiding in the Keys. When I started guiding, expectations
were pretty low. There weren’t
many guides around. I was
convinced to get my Captains license by someone who asked me to help take
overflow from Tarpon season. Five
years later the demand grew dramatically.
You went from having half-a-dozen full time guides in the keys to
upwards of 40 or 50 guides in the lower Keys. The Keys in general went from 40 or 50 guides to over 300
guides in the Keys. It became a
cool thing to do and attracted a lot of kids, and I was a kid, I started
guiding at 25. I think probably
the biggest change is that it’s harder for guides, unless they are veteran
guides with a solid reputation, to make a good living as a guide. It’s people’s imagination about being a
guide as being pretty romantic that you’re out there fishing everyday and
making $400-500 a day. If you’re
going to be a good guide you’re committing to going out there when no one else
would be out on the water. If you
are going to commit to being a good guide, you are committing to your clients
to be a part of their lives. They
are booking you a year in advance and in sometimes in perpetuity. You're put in very close situations with your
clients. It’s not the fantasy
world that a lot of people imagine.
But on the other hand I look back at the 11 years of my life as a guide
and it was the best years of my life.
What was your first skiff and what's the biggest change in
skiffs since that boat?
The first skiff I owned was one of the
earliest Action Crafts. It had sloped
gunnels that were influenced by Stu Apte.
I was the third owner, I believe Stu owned it first, then a gentleman in
Fort Myers, and then I owned it and ran it for a year and a half. Then I bought an early Hewes
Bonefisher. This was the first
year it came out without wood and with Kevlar. Had a huge
engine on it because I was 26 years old and I wanted to be the fastest on the
water. I went through that phase
and realized I didn’t want a huge engine to be poling all day. Then I moved to Maverick HP which later
turned to Maverick HPX and HPV.
When you were guiding, what was a typical day like?
Well, I don’t know that there were any
typical days. There were days that
there was no amount of money worth going out in and there were days I couldn’t
believe I was getting paid for doing what I was doing. Very rarely was the weather consistent
where you could settle into a pattern.
The times when you got comfortable and you convinced yourself that you
had it figured out something would happen and everything would change. The key skills that good guides need
are flexibility. When you’re
fishing at your best you have no idea where you’re going to go. You didn’t know where you are going to go
until you got to your destination.
Then we had a chance to look at what the conditions looked like.
For me I would get up at 5:00 or 5:30. Get the boat fueled up, ice, meet the
clients typically at 7. After the first
few years I wasn’t one of the guides who had to get out before sun up. In a given day I was fishing a lot of
different spots. I’m kind of
inpatient, I don’t like sitting in one spot too long. I would fish minimum 6-8 spots a day fishing the spots. Come home clean the boat and do it all
over again. If I had a day off,
all I could think of was where the fish would be.
How often do you get to Florida and do you still have a
skiff? Do you fish there with a
guide now or go out on your own?
I get back once or twice a year and at
the moment I don’t own a skiff although I’m on the verge of owning one
again. By the end of the year I’ll
probably have one down in Key West again.
I usually go out with friends and prefer to pole rather than fish. I really enjoy teaching others to
fish. It’s a lot of fun for me to
take out old clients. My son and
daughter are getting to an age when they are starting to enjoy it.
I heard in a previous interview you did that Jose Wejebe was
guiding at the same time as you.
With his tragic passing this year, do you have any good stories about
Jose that you would like to share?
He had been guiding for 6-7 years by
the time I got into it. He was a
veteran by the time I started. He
was one of the younger guys down there.
When I asked people who were the really good guides, his name was one of
the two names that came out. In my
mind there were two classes of guides: the guys who would stake out and wait
for fish and guys who understood that the real challenge was poling after
fish. Guys like Steve Huff, Jose, and
Harry Spear realized the real excitement was poling boats and poling hard. I got excited hearing about these guys
poling after 20-25 fish, poling back around and getting into these fish again. The other aspect is that everyone gets
competitive down there. You’re
always trying to outmaneuver the other guides. I learned quickly to be respectful of everybody else. I do remember a funny story about Jose
asking me about running over his fish in Archer Key Basin. He went on and on and on about it. He was a little crazed about it. I told him I was fishing in Pine Island
that day and he said “oh.” But
Jose was a really gifted guide. He
could fly fish with the best and was good at every kind of fishing.
Tom McGuane is listed as a contributing Midcurrent editor. I
think his writing is just brilliant and in terms of writing he's certainly
someone I greatly admire. Did I
read somewhere that you used to guide him? Can you tell me a little about your
relationship with him?
I met Tom in the 1980s and he was not a
client but he did become a client.
We fished at least once a year.
I developed a lot of friendships in Montana and got to know Tom and we
became pretty good friends. When I
decided to quit guiding I decided to go out to Montana. I have a couple funny stories about
Tom. The first day we ever fished
together we went west of Key West. By
9:30 in the morning we had seen a few permit and he then caught one. After we released the fish he said
“What do we do now?” I said, “What
do you mean?” "Well usually if we
catch a permit that’s considered a day." I said, "No no, we’re going to catch more."
Another story was a day when we were
fishing together and not much was going on. Another guide came up to my boat and said "This day reminds
me of a Tom McGuane day" and he preceded to quote for me a paragraph from one
of Tom’s books. Tom and I started giggling
and he said “Why are you laughing?”
I said “Mike, meet Tom McGuane.”
Had McGuane, Jim Harrison, and Jimmy Buffet left Key West by
the time you came on the scene or were they still part of the action?
All the guys had a love hate
relationship with Key West but by the time I got there they had burned out of
Key West. Some of that had to do with
the extracurricular activities. They went through a decade where they didn’t
want much to do with it. As they
matured they came back to it with a different perspective. Tom has an off and on relationship
with Key West. He really loved the
fishing aspect of it as much as the lifestyle. If I called Tom up today and
said lets go fishing in Key West he would say when.
Which writers do you really admire?
I read a lot of non-fishing stuff. One of the problems these days is I
have to read fishing so much. I
read 10-15 hours of fishing writing every week, if not more. When you’re forced to do that, you tend
to reach outside for other writing.
Of the writers of the past 25 years if I had to pick: McGuane certainly. Anything Jim
Harrison writes about fishing and food.
Jim Harrison’s poetry is really underappreciated and it’s too bad he
can’t write poetry full time because it’s phenomenal. Anything written by
Russell Chatham I think is worth reading.
He wrote some wonderful stuff in the 70s and 80s. Guy De La Valdene is a
fantastic writer. He doesn’t write
a lot of fishing stuff now but occasionally does. Nick Lyons is a fantastic writer and editor. He’s done really incredible things to
get fishing writing published and out there. There are a whole bunch of guys who have their own
followings that deserve attention too that I can’t think of all their names:
Ted Leeson, Carl Hiasson, Jim Babb, John Gierach.
Along those lines, which writers in the fishing genre are
you following and/or who are the up and comers?
Writing as a business is almost
nonexistent anymore. By that I
mean not that there aren’t people who are writing great stuff, and I’ll just
use Scott Sadil is an example. Here’s a guy who’s an incredibly talented writer
but his chances of making writing a full time career are difficult. You have people who are doing it in the
form of a blog or in books once every two or three years. If Scott continues to write about fly
fishing he’s going to write some really great stuff. Three or four blog writers I read intermittently. Mostly
because they are breaking the mold a little bit. Blogging went through an angry
“I’m better than you phase” where people started beating up on others. I don’t consider most of those writers
very good. Erin Block, Matt Smythe
(Fishing Poet). Miles Nolte at
Grays Sporting Journal is talented.
The biggest challenge is how do you find the way to do it. Magazines are going away because
advertisers don’t want to pay. The
landscape has changed and changed the way we write and why we write.
Are there skiff companies that you're really keeping your
eye on? What should we look for in
the future?
I think they are all interesting. An obvious example is Ankona and East
Cape. Two young companies with
similar ideas: Let’s produced some
really great skiffs for not too much money. The question is can they continue to evolve and be exciting
or do they saturate the market and sell to mostly their own customers and
wonder why they’re doing it because they’re not making much money. Harry Spear and what he’s doing. He has the ability to build the perfect
skiff because he has the experience of guiding. It will be interesting if he can pull it off. He really understands fishing.
What's the future look like for Midcurrent and Skiff
Republic?
Our audience keeps growing on
Midcurrent. I take that as a sign
that we are doing something right and need to be thankful for what we have
done. We will keep going forward and
trying new things while staying aware of
changing technology. I'll give you a specific example. Three years
our mobile audience was below 5 percent.
Now it’s about 30 percent and the growth has changed in the past
year. It doesn’t change the kind
of thing we are doing but it suggests the kind of thing we need to be thinking
about what people are doing 2-3 years for now. The way our home page looks for example. The trend toward video and imagery has
changed from 6 years ago when a page was focused on text. In the future it’s going to be heavily
video.
For Skiff Republic? Who knows, I’m trying to
have fun with it. I’m trying to
have fun with both Midcurrent and Skiff Republic, but Midcurrent is much
bigger. My to-do list is huge
right now with Midcurrent. You try
to have fun. I realized a while
ago I would be working when I’m 85 years old and that I better have fun doing
it.
